President Trump Legal Team Rejects Mueller’s Terms, Makes Counteroffer | The 11th Hour | MSNBC

President Trump Legal Team Rejects Mueller’s Terms, Makes Counteroffer | The 11th Hour | MSNBC
    Watch the video

    click to begin

    Youtube

    GOOD EVENING AND WELCOME TO YOU ALL.
    ALL. ROBERT COSTA, I'D LIKE TO BEGIN
    ROBERT COSTA, I'D LIKE TO BEGIN WITH YOU WITH THE PROVISO, THE
    WITH YOU WITH THE PROVISO, THE REMINDER TO EVERYBODY WATCHING
    REMINDER TO EVERYBODY WATCHING WE ARE SEEING EXACTLY ONE SIDE
    WE ARE SEEING EXACTLY ONE SIDE OF THESE NEGOTIATIONS OVER A
    OF THESE NEGOTIATIONS OVER A SIT-DOWN MEETING BETWEEN THE
    SIT-DOWN MEETING BETWEEN THE PRESIDENT AND MUELLER.
    PRESIDENT AND MUELLER. THE MUELLER TEAM DOESN'T TALK.
    THE MUELLER TEAM DOESN'T TALK. AND AS FAR AS WE KNOW, THEY
    AND AS FAR AS WE KNOW, THEY DON'T LEAK.
    DON'T LEAK. SO ROBERT, IS THIS ALL KIND OF A
    SO ROBERT, IS THIS ALL KIND OF A TV GAME SHOW WE'RE WATCHING?
    TV GAME SHOW WE'RE WATCHING? IS ANY OF THIS TRULY SERIOUS OR
    IS ANY OF THIS TRULY SERIOUS OR BINDING?
    BINDING? AND WILL YOU BELIEVE ANY OF IT
    AND WILL YOU BELIEVE ANY OF IT UNTIL IT HAPPENS?
    UNTIL IT HAPPENS? >> YOUR HEALTHY SKEPTICISM IS
    >> YOUR HEALTHY SKEPTICISM IS RIGHT ON, BRIAN, BECAUSE I'VE
    RIGHT ON, BRIAN, BECAUSE I'VE BEEN TALKING TO MAYOR GIULIANI
    BEEN TALKING TO MAYOR GIULIANI IN RECENT DAYS AND KEEP URGING
    IN RECENT DAYS AND KEEP URGING HIM, WE'D LIKE TO SEE THIS
    HIM, WE'D LIKE TO SEE THIS LETTER, THE RESPONSE YOU'VE
    LETTER, THE RESPONSE YOU'VE GIVEN TO BOB MUELLER AND HIS
    GIVEN TO BOB MUELLER AND HIS INVESTIGATORS.
    INVESTIGATORS. BUT THE PRESIDENT'S LAWYERS WILL
    BUT THE PRESIDENT'S LAWYERS WILL NOT RELEASE THE LAWYERS WHO ARE
    NOT RELEASE THE LAWYERS WHO ARE RELYING ON THEIR ACCOUNTS.
    RELYING ON THEIR ACCOUNTS. AND THEY CONTINUE TO REITERATE
    AND THEY CONTINUE TO REITERATE THAT THEY DON'T WANT TO HAVE THE
    THAT THEY DON'T WANT TO HAVE THE PRESIDENT SITTING DOWN WITH
    PRESIDENT SITTING DOWN WITH MUELLER TO TALK ABOUT THE FIRING
    MUELLER TO TALK ABOUT THE FIRING OF JIM COMEY AT THE FBI, TO TALK
    OF JIM COMEY AT THE FBI, TO TALK ABOUT THE NATIONAL SECURITY
    ABOUT THE NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER MIKE FLYNN AND WHAT THE
    ADVISER MIKE FLYNN AND WHAT THE PRESIDENT SAID TO COMEY ABOUT
    PRESIDENT SAID TO COMEY ABOUT LETTING IT GO, AND AS GIULIANI
    LETTING IT GO, AND AS GIULIANI SAYS, THEY REALLY BELIEVE
    SAYS, THEY REALLY BELIEVE MUELLER HAS A PERJURY TRAP HERE.
    MUELLER HAS A PERJURY TRAP HERE. BUT MUELLER, HE IS TRYING TO
    BUT MUELLER, HE IS TRYING TO FINISH THIS REPORT BASED ON OUR
    FINISH THIS REPORT BASED ON OUR REPORTING WITH FEDERAL
    REPORTING WITH FEDERAL INVESTIGATORS.
    INVESTIGATORS. AND HE'S TRYING TO GET IT DONE
    AND HE'S TRYING TO GET IT DONE BEFORE SEPTEMBER, BUT HE NEEDS
    BEFORE SEPTEMBER, BUT HE NEEDS TO FIGURE OUT THE PRESIDENT'S
    TO FIGURE OUT THE PRESIDENT'S INTENT.
    INTENT. AND UNTIL THE PRESIDENT SITS
    AND UNTIL THE PRESIDENT SITS DOWN, BRIAN, HE IS NOT GOING TO
    DOWN, BRIAN, HE IS NOT GOING TO REALLY HAVE THAT.
    REALLY HAVE THAT. >> BARBARA, YOU'RE THE LAWYER
    >> BARBARA, YOU'RE THE LAWYER HERE.
    HERE. REAL QUICK, THIS PHRASE "PERJURY
    REAL QUICK, THIS PHRASE "PERJURY TRAP" THAT WE HEAR ON A NEAR
    TRAP" THAT WE HEAR ON A NEAR DAILY BASIS.
    DAILY BASIS. I'VE HEARD SOME LAWYERS LIKE YOU
    I'VE HEARD SOME LAWYERS LIKE YOU ON TV SAY LISTEN, THE TRUTH WILL
    ON TV SAY LISTEN, THE TRUTH WILL SET YOU FREE.
    SET YOU FREE. THAT IF YOU TELL THE TRUTH, IF
    THAT IF YOU TELL THE TRUTH, IF THOSE AROUND YOU TELL THE TRUTH,
    THOSE AROUND YOU TELL THE TRUTH, THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A
    THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A PERJURY TRAP.
    PERJURY TRAP. WHAT DO PEOPLE MEAN BY PERJURY
    WHAT DO PEOPLE MEAN BY PERJURY TRAP?
    TRAP? >> AT LEAST AT THE DEPARTMENT OF
    >> AT LEAST AT THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE, THE IDEA OF A PERJURY
    JUSTICE, THE IDEA OF A PERJURY TRAP IS FORBIDDEN.
    TRAP IS FORBIDDEN. AND THAT IS WHEN YOU HAVE NO
    AND THAT IS WHEN YOU HAVE NO LEGITIMATE PURPOSE FOR CALLING
    LEGITIMATE PURPOSE FOR CALLING SOMEONE THE A GRAND JURY OTHER
    SOMEONE THE A GRAND JURY OTHER THAN TO TRY TO CATCH THEM IN A
    THAN TO TRY TO CATCH THEM IN A LIE.
    LIE. THAT IS YOU DON'T BELIEVE
    THAT IS YOU DON'T BELIEVE THEY'VE COMMITTED ANY OTHER
    THEY'VE COMMITTED ANY OTHER CRIME.
    CRIME. BUT YOU'RE GOING TO TRY TO CATCH
    BUT YOU'RE GOING TO TRY TO CATCH THEM IN A LIE SO YOU CAN CHARGE
    THEM IN A LIE SO YOU CAN CHARGE THEM WITH THAT LIE.
    THEM WITH THAT LIE. I THINK IN THIS INSTANCE IT'S
    I THINK IN THIS INSTANCE IT'S CLEAR THAT ROBERT MUELLER HAS A
    CLEAR THAT ROBERT MUELLER HAS A LOT OF LEGITIMATE QUESTIONS THAT
    LOT OF LEGITIMATE QUESTIONS THAT HE WANTS TO ASK OF PRESIDENT
    HE WANTS TO ASK OF PRESIDENT TRUMP.
    TRUMP. AND THE IDEA THAT IT'S A PERJURY
    AND THE IDEA THAT IT'S A PERJURY TRAP ONLY EXISTS IF HE CHOOSES
    TRAP ONLY EXISTS IF HE CHOOSES TO LIE.
    TO LIE. >> NOW JONATHAN LEMIRE, THE
    >> NOW JONATHAN LEMIRE, THE QUESTION FOR YOU WHICH MAY CALL
    QUESTION FOR YOU WHICH MAY CALL FOR A JUDGMENT, WHAT IS GREATER
    FOR A JUDGMENT, WHAT IS GREATER DO YOU THINK IN THE TRUMP CAMP?
    DO YOU THINK IN THE TRUMP CAMP? THE FEAR OF A SUBPOENA OR THE
    THE FEAR OF A SUBPOENA OR THE FEAR OF PERJURY?
    FEAR OF PERJURY? >> I THINK THEY'RE WORRIED ABOUT
    >> I THINK THEY'RE WORRIED ABOUT BOTH.
    BOTH. I MEAN, THEY BELIEVE THEY HAVE
    I MEAN, THEY BELIEVE THEY HAVE LEGAL ARGUMENTS TO PROTECT THEM
    LEGAL ARGUMENTS TO PROTECT THEM AGAINST A SUBPOENA.
    AGAINST A SUBPOENA. THEY DENT BELIEVE THAT THE
    THEY DENT BELIEVE THAT THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE IN THE
    DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE IN THE CODE THERE THAT MUELLER IS
    CODE THERE THAT MUELLER IS CERTAINLY A BUY THE BOOK
    CERTAINLY A BUY THE BOOK PROSECUTOR, AND WE BELIEVE THAT
    PROSECUTOR, AND WE BELIEVE THAT THEY BELIEVE THAT THEY WOULD NOT
    THEY BELIEVE THAT THEY WOULD NOT FOR THAT.
    FOR THAT. PERHAPS IT'S PERJURY.
    PERHAPS IT'S PERJURY. EVERYONE, AS I REPORTED BEFORE,
    EVERYONE, AS I REPORTED BEFORE, PEOPLE AROUND THE PRESIDENT JUST
    PEOPLE AROUND THE PRESIDENT JUST FEEL THAT HE IS WALKING INTO A
    FEEL THAT HE IS WALKING INTO A LAND MINE SITUATION IF HE GOES
    LAND MINE SITUATION IF HE GOES IN THERE, THAT HE IS SO
    IN THERE, THAT HE IS SO UNDISCIPLINED WHEN HE SPEAKS,
    UNDISCIPLINED WHEN HE SPEAKS, AND THAT HE SOMETIMES WILL TRY
    AND THAT HE SOMETIMES WILL TRY TO SAY THINGS TO WIN OVER THE
    TO SAY THINGS TO WIN OVER THE ROOM AND TO CURRY FAVOR WITH
    ROOM AND TO CURRY FAVOR WITH THESE INVESTIGATORS.
    THESE INVESTIGATORS. HE'S GOING TO WALK IN THERE AND
    HE'S GOING TO WALK IN THERE AND SOME SOME MISTRUTHS OR SAY
    SOME SOME MISTRUTHS OR SAY THINGS THAT AREN'T RIGHT OR BE
    THINGS THAT AREN'T RIGHT OR BE SELECTIVE IN WHAT HE SAYS AND
    SELECTIVE IN WHAT HE SAYS AND THEREFORE AS GIULIANI SAYS, WALK
    THEREFORE AS GIULIANI SAYS, WALK HIMSELF INTO PERJURY.
    HIMSELF INTO PERJURY. THE PRESIDENT, THOUGH, TO THIS
    THE PRESIDENT, THOUGH, TO THIS POINT IS PUBLICLY SAYING HE
    POINT IS PUBLICLY SAYING HE STILL WANTS TO DO THIS.
    STILL WANTS TO DO THIS. I THINK THE LONG THEIR GOES ON,
    I THINK THE LONG THEIR GOES ON, THE MORE THAT GIULIANI AND THE
    THE MORE THAT GIULIANI AND THE LEGAL TEAM MOVES THE GOALPOST
    LEGAL TEAM MOVES THE GOALPOST SORT OF MAKING IT ALMOST
    SORT OF MAKING IT ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE FOR MUELLER TO
    IMPOSSIBLE FOR MUELLER TO FINALLY TO AGREE TO THIS.
    FINALLY TO AGREE TO THIS. AS MUCH AS THE SPECIAL COUNSEL
    AS MUCH AS THE SPECIAL COUNSEL DOES WANT THIS INTERVIEW.
    DOES WANT THIS INTERVIEW. AS BOB JUST SAID THAT.
    AS BOB JUST SAID THAT. >> NEED TO BE ABLE TO IDENTIFY.
    >> NEED TO BE ABLE TO IDENTIFY. THEY NEED TO FIGURE OUT THE
    THEY NEED TO FIGURE OUT THE INTENT WHAT WAS BEHIND THE
    INTENT WHAT WAS BEHIND THE PRESIDENT, THE ACTIONS WHEN HE
    PRESIDENT, THE ACTIONS WHEN HE MOVED WHETHER IT WAS COMEY OR
    MOVED WHETHER IT WAS COMEY OR FLYNN AND SO ON.
    FLYNN AND SO ON. BUT AT SOME POINT THEY'RE GOING
    BUT AT SOME POINT THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE A DECISION, IF
    TO HAVE TO MAKE A DECISION, IF HE IS NOT GOING TO SIT DOWN,
    HE IS NOT GOING TO SIT DOWN, THEN WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THE
    THEN WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THE SUBPOENA.
    SUBPOENA. I THINK AT THIS POINT, GIULIANI
    I THINK AT THIS POINT, GIULIANI AND OTHERS, THEY'RE TRYING TO
    AND OTHERS, THEY'RE TRYING TO RUN OUT THE CLOCK HERE.
    RUN OUT THE CLOCK HERE. THEY KNOW THAT MUELLER IS TRYING
    THEY KNOW THAT MUELLER IS TRYING NOT TO WADE INTO THE MID TERMS.
    NOT TO WADE INTO THE MID TERMS. THAT IF HE DOESN'T DO IT THEN,
    THAT IF HE DOESN'T DO IT THEN, HE TABLES IT AS OF LABOR DAY AND
    HE TABLES IT AS OF LABOR DAY AND REVISITS IN NOVEMBER OR
    REVISITS IN NOVEMBER OR DECEMBER, EVEN THOUGH, OF
    DECEMBER, EVEN THOUGH, OF COURSE, WE DID SEE JIM COMEY
    COURSE, WE DID SEE JIM COMEY OPEN UP A FEDERAL INVESTIGATION
    OPEN UP A FEDERAL INVESTIGATION THAT ABSOLUTELY MATTERED TO AN
    THAT ABSOLUTELY MATTERED TO AN ELECTION JUST ABOUT TEN DAYS
    ELECTION JUST ABOUT TEN DAYS BEFORE VOTERS WENT TO THE BALLOT
    BEFORE VOTERS WENT TO THE BALLOT BOX.
    BOX. >> MORE ON THAT IN A MOMENT.
    >> MORE ON THAT IN A MOMENT. BARB, I WATCHED GIULIANI ON FOX
    BARB, I WATCHED GIULIANI ON FOX TONIGHT.
    TONIGHT. AT A CERTAIN POINT, GIULIANI
    AT A CERTAIN POINT, GIULIANI STOPPED TALKING ABOUT THIS.
    STOPPED TALKING ABOUT THIS. HE KIND OF REFERRED TO --
    HE KIND OF REFERRED TO -- DEFERRED TO JAY SEKULOW.
    DEFERRED TO JAY SEKULOW. A, IT IS POSSIBLE ONE OF THE
    A, IT IS POSSIBLE ONE OF THE FEDS SAID YOUR SIDE SHOULD
    FEDS SAID YOUR SIDE SHOULD REALLY STOP TALKING ABOUT THESE
    REALLY STOP TALKING ABOUT THESE NEGOTIATIONS?
    NEGOTIATIONS? AND, B, WHAT ARE THE FEDS LIKELY
    AND, B, WHAT ARE THE FEDS LIKELY TO MAKE OF ALL THIS PUBLIC
    TO MAKE OF ALL THIS PUBLIC SHARING OF LETTERS AND DEMANDS
    SHARING OF LETTERS AND DEMANDS AND NO QUESTIONS ON OBSTRUCTION
    AND NO QUESTIONS ON OBSTRUCTION AND THE LIKE?
    AND THE LIKE? >> WELL, ORDINARILY, THE
    >> WELL, ORDINARILY, THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE DOESN'T
    DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE DOESN'T WANT TO SILENCE PEOPLE WHO WANT
    WANT TO SILENCE PEOPLE WHO WANT TO TALK.
    TO TALK. THEY HAVE FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHTS
    THEY HAVE FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHTS TO DO THAT.
    TO DO THAT. SO I'M SURE THEY DON'T LIKE IT.
    SO I'M SURE THEY DON'T LIKE IT. THEY PROBABLY AREN'T HAPPY WITH
    THEY PROBABLY AREN'T HAPPY WITH IT.
    IT. IT MAY NOT EVEN BE ACCURATE.
    IT MAY NOT EVEN BE ACCURATE. BUT THEY'RE PROBABLY NOT GOING
    BUT THEY'RE PROBABLY NOT GOING TO DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT IF
    TO DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT IF GIULIANI AND SEKULOW WANT TO
    GIULIANI AND SEKULOW WANT TO CONTINUE TO TALK ABOUT IT.
    CONTINUE TO TALK ABOUT IT. I DON'T THINK IT ADVANCES THEIR
    I DON'T THINK IT ADVANCES THEIR POSITION IN NEGOTIATING BY
    POSITION IN NEGOTIATING BY TALKING ABOUT IT IN THE PUBLIC
    TALKING ABOUT IT IN THE PUBLIC SPHERE.
    SPHERE. BUT I DON'T THINK THAT THE
    BUT I DON'T THINK THAT THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT IS GOING TO
    JUSTICE DEPARTMENT IS GOING TO ORDER THEM TO STOP IN ANY WAY.
    ORDER THEM TO STOP IN ANY WAY. BUT YOU'RE RIGHT THAT THE AFFECT
    BUT YOU'RE RIGHT THAT THE AFFECT OF IT ALL IS WE GET THIS VERY
    OF IT ALL IS WE GET THIS VERY ONE-SIDED NARRATIVE.
    ONE-SIDED NARRATIVE. WE DENT EVEN KNOW WHETHER IT'S
    WE DENT EVEN KNOW WHETHER IT'S TRUE.
    TRUE. THEY MADE REPRESENTATIONS ABOUT
    THEY MADE REPRESENTATIONS ABOUT THEIR LETTER.
    THEIR LETTER. WE HAVEN'T SEEN THE LETTER AND
    WE HAVEN'T SEEN THE LETTER AND CERTAINLY WE'RE NOT HEARING FROM
    CERTAINLY WE'RE NOT HEARING FROM ROBERT MUELLER.
    ROBERT MUELLER. SO WE DON'T KNOW WHAT IT SAYS.
    SO WE DON'T KNOW WHAT IT SAYS. BUT I DO GET THE SENSE THAT
    BUT I DO GET THE SENSE THAT THEY'RE SLOW-WALKING THIS.
    THEY'RE SLOW-WALKING THIS. THEY'RE TRYING GET THEMSELVES AS
    THEY'RE TRYING GET THEMSELVES AS CLOSE TO SEPTEMBER AS POSSIBLE.
    CLOSE TO SEPTEMBER AS POSSIBLE. SAY WE'RE NEGOTIATING, WE'RE
    SAY WE'RE NEGOTIATING, WE'RE STILL KEEPING THE DOOR OPEN
    STILL KEEPING THE DOOR OPEN BECAUSE THEY KNOW THAT AS THAT
    BECAUSE THEY KNOW THAT AS THAT ELECTION APPROACHES, IT'S LESS
    ELECTION APPROACHES, IT'S LESS LIKELY THAT ROBERT MUELLER WOULD
    LIKELY THAT ROBERT MUELLER WOULD SERVE THAT SUBPOENA AND LAUNCH
    SERVE THAT SUBPOENA AND LAUNCH WHAT'S LIKELY TO BE SOME VERY
    WHAT'S LIKELY TO BE SOME VERY EXPLOSIVE LITIGATION.
    EXPLOSIVE LITIGATION. >> ALSO, BARB, WHAT IS RUDY
    >> ALSO, BARB, WHAT IS RUDY TALKING ABOUT WHEN HE SAYS THIS
    TALKING ABOUT WHEN HE SAYS THIS INVESTIGATION WILL VIOLATE DOJ
    INVESTIGATION WILL VIOLATE DOJ RULES IF IT GOES PAST SEPTEMBER
    RULES IF IT GOES PAST SEPTEMBER 1?
    1? >> WELL, HE IS CONFLATING SOME
    >> WELL, HE IS CONFLATING SOME THINGS HERE.
    THINGS HERE. I DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT'S
    I DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT'S INTENTIONAL OR NOT, BUT THERE
    INTENTIONAL OR NOT, BUT THERE ARE SOMETIMES SOMETHING REFERRED
    ARE SOMETIMES SOMETHING REFERRED TO AS A 60-DAY RULE BEFORE AN
    TO AS A 60-DAY RULE BEFORE AN ELECTION, THERE IS USUALLY A
    ELECTION, THERE IS USUALLY A COOLING OFF PERIOD.
    COOLING OFF PERIOD. THE LANGUAGE OF THE RULE REALLY
    THE LANGUAGE OF THE RULE REALLY IS VERY BROAD.
    IS VERY BROAD. IT JUST SAYS PROSECUTORS
    IT JUST SAYS PROSECUTORS SHOULDN'T DO ANYTHING TO
    SHOULDN'T DO ANYTHING TO INFLUENCE THE OUTCOME OF AN
    INFLUENCE THE OUTCOME OF AN ELECTION.
    ELECTION. AND WHAT YOU DO OR DON'T DO
    AND WHAT YOU DO OR DON'T DO REALLY DEPENDS ON THE FACTS OF
    REALLY DEPENDS ON THE FACTS OF THE CASE.
    THE CASE. BUT MANY PEOPLE HAVE INTERPRETED
    BUT MANY PEOPLE HAVE INTERPRETED THAT TO BE SORT OF A 60-DAY RULE
    THAT TO BE SORT OF A 60-DAY RULE THAT SAYS WHEN YOU GET 60 DAYS
    THAT SAYS WHEN YOU GET 60 DAYS OUT OF AN ELECTION, YOU PROBABLY
    OUT OF AN ELECTION, YOU PROBABLY SHOULD COOL OFF AND NOT FILE
    SHOULD COOL OFF AND NOT FILE ANYTHING PUBLICLY.
    ANYTHING PUBLICLY. SO WITH THE ELECTIONS IN
    SO WITH THE ELECTIONS IN NOVEMBER, THAT WOULD BE ABOUT
    NOVEMBER, THAT WOULD BE ABOUT LABOR DAY.
    LABOR DAY. SO I THINK THERE HAVE BEEN MANY
    SO I THINK THERE HAVE BEEN MANY SUGGESTING THAT ROBERT MUELLER
    SUGGESTING THAT ROBERT MUELLER WOULD BE UNLIKELY TO SERVE A
    WOULD BE UNLIKELY TO SERVE A SUBPOENA THEN.
    SUBPOENA THEN. BUT TO SUGGEST THE INVESTIGATION
    BUT TO SUGGEST THE INVESTIGATION NEEDS TO BE OVER BY THEN IS A
    NEEDS TO BE OVER BY THEN IS A VERY DIFFERENT THING.
    VERY DIFFERENT THING. EVEN IF HE DOES GO INTO A
    EVEN IF HE DOES GO INTO A COOLING OFF PERIOD, WHICH HE MAY
    COOLING OFF PERIOD, WHICH HE MAY OR MAY NOT DO WITH TRUMP ON THE
    OR MAY NOT DO WITH TRUMP ON THE BALLOT, NOTHING SAYS HE HAS TO
    BALLOT, NOTHING SAYS HE HAS TO BE DONE BY THAT POINT.
    BE DONE BY THAT POINT. >> NO ONE EXPECTS MUELLER TO DO
    >> NO ONE EXPECTS MUELLER TO DO ANYTHING INCAUTIOUS, A.
    ANYTHING INCAUTIOUS, A. AND B, ONE OF THE HARDENED
    AND B, ONE OF THE HARDENED CYNICS IN OUR BUSINESS PROFFERED
    CYNICS IN OUR BUSINESS PROFFERED THIS THEORY TONIGHT, AND THAT IS
    THIS THEORY TONIGHT, AND THAT IS THAT BY SAYING SEPTEMBER 1, BY
    THAT BY SAYING SEPTEMBER 1, BY GETTING THAT OUT INTO THE
    GETTING THAT OUT INTO THE BLOODSTREAM, RUDY, WHO IS A
    BLOODSTREAM, RUDY, WHO IS A MEMBER OF THIS TEAM THAT SAYS
    MEMBER OF THIS TEAM THAT SAYS NOTHING REALLY BY ACCIDENT.
    NOTHING REALLY BY ACCIDENT. USUALLY IT'S BACK REFERENCED,
    USUALLY IT'S BACK REFERENCED, MAY BE GETTING INTO THE PUBLIC
    MAY BE GETTING INTO THE PUBLIC CONSCIOUSNESS WHAT HE SEES AS A
    CONSCIOUSNESS WHAT HE SEES AS A WIN IF AND ABOUT WHEN MUELLER
    WIN IF AND ABOUT WHEN MUELLER SUSPENDS FOR ELECTION SEASON,
    SUSPENDS FOR ELECTION SEASON, THEY CAN SAY IT'S BEEN PROPERLY
    THEY CAN SAY IT'S BEEN PROPERLY THIS INVESTIGATION BEEN PAUSED,
    THIS INVESTIGATION BEEN PAUSED, AND THAT'S A VICTORY FOR US.
    AND THAT'S A VICTORY FOR US. >> THAT'S RIGHT, BRIAN.
    >> THAT'S RIGHT, BRIAN. TALKING TO MAYOR GIULIANI, YOU
    TALKING TO MAYOR GIULIANI, YOU SEE HIM PREPARING RIGHT NOW POUR
    SEE HIM PREPARING RIGHT NOW POUR THE SUBPOENA, FIGHT THAT
    THE SUBPOENA, FIGHT THAT SUBPOENA THREAT, GOES ALL THE
    SUBPOENA THREAT, GOES ALL THE WAY BECOME TO MARCH WHEN MUELLER
    WAY BECOME TO MARCH WHEN MUELLER MADE IT IN A PRIVATE EXCHANGE
    MADE IT IN A PRIVATE EXCHANGE WITH THEN TRUMP ATTORNEY JOHN
    WITH THEN TRUMP ATTORNEY JOHN DOWD.
    DOWD. THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS ON EDGE,
    THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS ON EDGE, ESPECIALLY AFTER TUESDAY'S
    ESPECIALLY AFTER TUESDAY'S PRIMARIES IN OHIO AND ELSEWHERE
    PRIMARIES IN OHIO AND ELSEWHERE ABOUT THE MIDTERM ELECTIONS.
    ABOUT THE MIDTERM ELECTIONS. THEY DON'T WANT TO HAVE THE
    THEY DON'T WANT TO HAVE THE MUELLER REPORT HANGING OVER
    MUELLER REPORT HANGING OVER THEIR HEADS.
    THEIR HEADS. IN MY CONVERSATIONS WITH
    IN MY CONVERSATIONS WITH REPUBLICAN LAWMAKERS ON CAPITOL
    REPUBLICAN LAWMAKERS ON CAPITOL HILL, THEY'RE TELLING THE WHITE
    HILL, THEY'RE TELLING THE WHITE HOUSE, THEY'RE TELLING TRUMP
    HOUSE, THEY'RE TELLING TRUMP ALLIES, THEY'RE TELLING GIULIANI
    ALLIES, THEY'RE TELLING GIULIANI AND THE PRESIDENT, ANYTHING YOU
    AND THE PRESIDENT, ANYTHING YOU CAN TO GET RUSSIA OFF OF OUR
    CAN TO GET RUSSIA OFF OF OUR PLATE, WE'D APPRECIATE IT.
    PLATE, WE'D APPRECIATE IT. AND THEY KNOW THEY HAVE TO TAKE
    AND THEY KNOW THEY HAVE TO TAKE A TOUGH LINE AND SANCTIONS.
    A TOUGH LINE AND SANCTIONS. THE PARTY IS MORE HAWKISH THAN
    THE PARTY IS MORE HAWKISH THAN THE PRESIDENT OF RUSSIA, BUT
    THE PRESIDENT OF RUSSIA, BUT THEY WANT THIS MUELLER REPORT TO
    THEY WANT THIS MUELLER REPORT TO BE NOT HANGING OUT THERE AS A
    BE NOT HANGING OUT THERE AS A VARIABLE.
    VARIABLE. AND SO THAT'S WHY IN PART THIS
    AND SO THAT'S WHY IN PART THIS IS A POLITICAL STRATEGY FOR
    IS A POLITICAL STRATEGY FOR GIULIANI AS MUCH AS A LEGAL
    GIULIANI AS MUCH AS A LEGAL STRATEGY.
    STRATEGY. >> JONATHAN LEMIRE, I WANT TO
    >> JONATHAN LEMIRE, I WANT TO READ YOU THE QUOTE, TWO VERY
    READ YOU THE QUOTE, TWO VERY YOUNG PROMISING WRITERS A THE
    YOUNG PROMISING WRITERS A THE ASSOCIATED PRESS HAVE WORKED
    ASSOCIATED PRESS HAVE WORKED TOGETHER ON THIS PIECE.
    TOGETHER ON THIS PIECE. OH, LOOK, IT'S YOU AND YOUR
    OH, LOOK, IT'S YOU AND YOUR CO-AUTHOR.
    CO-AUTHOR. TRUMP HAS SEETHED TO CONFIDANTES
    TRUMP HAS SEETHED TO CONFIDANTES THAT HE VIEWS THE MANAFORT
    THAT HE VIEWS THE MANAFORT CHARGES AS A WARNING SHOT FROM
    CHARGES AS A WARNING SHOT FROM MUELLER.
    MUELLER. HE HAS TOLD THOSE CLOSE TO HIM
    HE HAS TOLD THOSE CLOSE TO HIM THAT AS HE WATCHES THE COURTROOM
    THAT AS HE WATCHES THE COURTROOM PROCEEDINGS, HE FEARS THAT
    PROCEEDINGS, HE FEARS THAT DONALD TRUMP JR. COULD AT SOME
    DONALD TRUMP JR. COULD AT SOME POINT BE THE ONE ON TRIAL, LEFT
    POINT BE THE ONE ON TRIAL, LEFT OUT ALL THE CAREFUL SOURCING
    OUT ALL THE CAREFUL SOURCING THAT YOU WERE CAREFUL TO PUT IN
    THAT YOU WERE CAREFUL TO PUT IN THIS.
    THIS. YOU'RE JUST BACK FROM
    YOU'RE JUST BACK FROM BEDMINSTER, NEW JERSEY.
    BEDMINSTER, NEW JERSEY. HOW IS THE PRESIDENT ENJOYING
    HOW IS THE PRESIDENT ENJOYING HIS VACATION?
    HIS VACATION? >> WE HAVEN'T SEEN TOO MUCH OF
    >> WE HAVEN'T SEEN TOO MUCH OF HIM ON THE VACATION.
    HIM ON THE VACATION. >> EXACTLY THE WAY THEY PLANNED
    >> EXACTLY THE WAY THEY PLANNED IT.
    IT. >> THAT'S RIGHT.
    >> THAT'S RIGHT. HE DID HAVE A DINNER WITH
    HE DID HAVE A DINNER WITH BUSINESS LEADER LAST NIGHT.
    BUSINESS LEADER LAST NIGHT. WE SAW THE FIRST FEW MINUTES OF
    WE SAW THE FIRST FEW MINUTES OF IT.
    IT. BUT LARGELY HE HAS BEEN LAYING
    BUT LARGELY HE HAS BEEN LAYING LOW.
    LOW. THE WHITE HOUSE HASN'T BEEN
    THE WHITE HOUSE HASN'T BEEN SPEAKING OUT WHO HE HAS BEEN
    SPEAKING OUT WHO HE HAS BEEN READING WITH AND GOLFING WITH.
    READING WITH AND GOLFING WITH. WE KNOW OVER THE LAST TEN DAYS
    WE KNOW OVER THE LAST TEN DAYS OR SO, WE HAVE SEEN REFLECTED IN
    OR SO, WE HAVE SEEN REFLECTED IN HIS TWEETS, AS WELL AS THESE
    HIS TWEETS, AS WELL AS THESE PRIVATE CONVERSATIONS HOW UPSET
    PRIVATE CONVERSATIONS HOW UPSET HE HAS BEEN WATCHING THE
    HE HAS BEEN WATCHING THE MANAFORT TRIAL DAY AFTER DAY.
    MANAFORT TRIAL DAY AFTER DAY. IT'S THE CABLE COVERAGE, IT'S IN
    IT'S THE CABLE COVERAGE, IT'S IN HIS FACE.
    HIS FACE. IT'S MOSTLY YOU, INESCAPABLE
    IT'S MOSTLY YOU, INESCAPABLE EVERY DAY THAT HE SEES IT THERE.
    EVERY DAY THAT HE SEES IT THERE. AND THAT HE -- AS HE'S TOLD
    AND THAT HE -- AS HE'S TOLD PEOPLE AROUND HIM, HE FEELS THAT
    PEOPLE AROUND HIM, HE FEELS THAT SORT OF MUELLER'S OPENING ACT.
    SORT OF MUELLER'S OPENING ACT. EVEN THOUGH THIS TRIAL IS NOT
    EVEN THOUGH THIS TRIAL IS NOT ABOUT RUSSIA, BUT HE FEELS
    ABOUT RUSSIA, BUT HE FEELS MUELLER'S HAND IS INVOLVED,
    MUELLER'S HAND IS INVOLVED, OBVIOUSLY MANAFORT WAS A
    OBVIOUSLY MANAFORT WAS A PROMINENT PART OF HIS CAMPAIGN
    PROMINENT PART OF HIS CAMPAIGN AND IT'S A SENSE OF WHAT COULD
    AND IT'S A SENSE OF WHAT COULD STILL BE TO COME.
    STILL BE TO COME. EVEN THOUGH HE DOESN'T BELIEVE
    EVEN THOUGH HE DOESN'T BELIEVE HIS SON DID ANYTHING WRONG, BUT
    HIS SON DID ANYTHING WRONG, BUT HE SUGGESTS THAT A, HE
    HE SUGGESTS THAT A, HE INADVERTENTLY BROKE THE LAW,
    INADVERTENTLY BROKE THE LAW, PERHAPS, OR B, HE IS SIMPLY THE
    PERHAPS, OR B, HE IS SIMPLY THE VICTIM OF A WITCH-HUNT.
    VICTIM OF A WITCH-HUNT. STOP ME IF YOU'VE HEARD THAT
    STOP ME IF YOU'VE HEARD THAT BEFORE FROM THE PRESIDENT.
    BEFORE FROM THE PRESIDENT. AND IN THIS CASE, HE FEELS THAT
    AND IN THIS CASE, HE FEELS THAT THAT COULD BE NEXT.
    THAT COULD BE NEXT. AND THAT IS SOMETHING THAT EVEN
    AND THAT IS SOMETHING THAT EVEN THOUGH PUBLICLY HE IS SUGGESTING
    THOUGH PUBLICLY HE IS SUGGESTING I'M NOT WORRIED ABOUT DON JR.,
    I'M NOT WORRIED ABOUT DON JR., PRIVATELY HE IS.
    PRIVATELY HE IS. DON JR. HIMSELF ALSO VERY MUCH
    DON JR. HIMSELF ALSO VERY MUCH TAKING THIS BRASH APPROACH,
    TAKING THIS BRASH APPROACH, MOVING FOR WARD.
    MOVING FOR WARD. HE HAS BECOME A VERY POPULAR
    HE HAS BECOME A VERY POPULAR SURROGATE AMONG REPUBLICANS FOR
    SURROGATE AMONG REPUBLICANS FOR THE MIDTERM ELECTIONS
    THE MIDTERM ELECTIONS CRISSCROSSING THE COUNTRY.
    CRISSCROSSING THE COUNTRY. SO HE IS NOT LETTING THIS SLOW
    SO HE IS NOT LETTING THIS SLOW HIM DOWN.
    HIM DOWN. >> BIG THANKS TO OUR BIG THREE
    Rudy Giuliani 'Wildly Off-Base' On Robert Mueller Probe | Morning Joe | MSNBC Republicans Face Several Challenges Heading Into The Midterms | The 11th Hour | MSNBC The Speed of Light is NOT About Light | Space Time | PBS Digital Studios Maryland AG: Trump First Person In History To Profiteer From This Higher Office | MTP Daily | MSNBC Televangelists: Last Week Tonight with John Oliver (HBO) Is Donald Trump likely to be impeached? - BBC Newsnight Nunes On Secret Tape: Brett Kavanaugh Vote, Then Rod Rosenstein Impeachment | Rachel Maddow | MSNBC Inside The Awesome New VW Camper "California" 4-Star General Warns: President Trump Behavior 'More Alarming And Illogical' | The Last Word | MSNBC The Rogue Tesla Mechanic Resurrecting Salvaged Cars